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riptiz
United Kingdom
741 Posts |
 Posted - Mar 11 2007 : 07:57:34 AM
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Hi Mike,all,
Further to discussion on another thread I wanted to expand further on this.Mike talked of using one's own energy(chi) compared to Reiki but much of what is discussed in energy healing is based on one's belief rather than scientific evidence.Neither chi or Reiki have been measured to my knowledge, nor has it been established that they are even different energies, or even exist in a measurable way.Personally I don't believe that Reiki is any different than any other healing system except in it's system which in some circles is under debate.Although Reiki relies on an attunement system and symbols to give access to the energy, these tools are available to all if only they know how to tap into them. Certainly symbols are not needed and some believe that they were introduced to help students focus their intent because they were having difficulties otherwise.Although trained in Reiki I have personally never found the symbols necessary for either healing work OR attuning others.Intent is the most important tool we possess and it is easier to use than explain to another how to use it.
Mike when you speak of overdoing it and draining yourself, you are actually talking about changing your intent and becoming a 'healer' and not a channel.My background started in Karate, TM, Aikido, Tai Chi/Reiki before my present practice of Kundalini Maha Yoga.In my experience, as one meditates and increases their channeling abilities through purification, I cannot see how you can make a cut off from what you call Reiki and what has been gained from meditation.Certainly what is available from an attunement is at a much lower level than what is available after some time meditating.This has been my experience and of my students and peers.As one rises in levels more tools become available, psychic surgery, manipulation of others energy circuits but of course these would not be regarded as Reiki practices but the energy would be no different, only the intent.When I have attuned others in the past with Reiki I have used intent which has made no difference to using the root lock and the symbols.In fact the root lock is as you know is a bhanda but I have found it unnecessary.In fact by using intent you can in theory attune many others at the same time and I have found no difference as the energy contnues to flow even after the intent has consciously finished.Why? because the intent is set to continue subconsciously.
In my experience the only difference in using Reiki or chi is the intent behind it. If one asks God to give 'healing' energies that the recipient needs(setting intent)or intending to 'heal' them yourself ie taking God's place in the healing rather than channeling the energy from the universe.
L&L
Dave |
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Mike
United Kingdom
77 Posts |
Posted - Mar 11 2007 : 12:34:56 PM
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Hi Dave
Well we deserve some brownie points for doing the moderators jobs for them and moving threads 
All of what you say sounds sensible...
I would quibble over your use of the word "system" in saying they are all the same... of course many many different techniques... eg the recent work I mentioned I had been doing was Dit Da five element massage which uses chi as well as physical massage movements.
Re the energies I really haven't yet reached a firm conclusion... other than my analogy with paint... you go to the store and there are red paint pots, blue paint pots... but they are all paint.
One obvious difference between "reiki" and "chi" is that it is only possible to send reiki to someone... whereas you can add or remove chi from someone (eg depletion in an area then clockwise circling will add energy... and vice versa).
Another is you can also use chi for attacking/martial arts purposes whereas I have never seen any such usage of Reiki.
Another is you can send (as story below) a large volume of chi in a short period of time (hence one can use martially) whereas you cannot with Reiki.
Sure intent differs re reiki and chi but then so does it between peeling an orange and driving a car  so I still find it hard coming to some simple idea myself.
In practical terms though if I send you reiki then sure its the 'hollow bamboo' idea where I am conduiting external energy to you... In the process I am not weakened but rather 'take a tax' on the energy that passes through me and am cleansed by it. If I send you my chi then I definitely am weakened.
As an example of the latter I once sent someone chi remotely (when I hadnt practiced much) after my Zhan Zhuang practice (they were in dire need and very weak). Now normally after 45mins ZZ I feel 'strong' for some time... So I sent the energy and tried *really hard* (oops big mistake  ) - within about a minute I felt so weak I had to go down and sit on a chair - very depleted... 
Random thoughts!
Mike |
Edited by - Mike on Mar 11 2007 12:37:55 PM |
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riptiz
United Kingdom
741 Posts |
Posted - Mar 11 2007 : 2:09:23 PM
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Hi Mike,
Well I'm not sure about only sending Reiki, I have seen some who claim to be able to de-attune people but personally I think that is BS.Yes I agree you don't hear of using Reiki to attack others but that would be against the moral standards contained within the Reiki precepts.What I mean is where does Reiki start or end, it's difficult to be clear on this?If one can help others using good intent then it is also possible to do bad using bad intent.This is normally known as psychic attack is it not?
quote 'In practical terms though if I send you reiki then sure its the 'hollow bamboo' idea where I am conduiting external energy to you... In the process I am not weakened but rather 'take a tax' on the energy that passes through me and am cleansed by it. If I send you my chi then I definitely am weakened.'
I cannot sign up for this theory I'm afraid.
As the recipient takes what he/she needs then if I am able to conduit 110 volts(for an analogy), but my client needs 240 volts then where do you suppose they get the other 130 volts from? As you know this is why it's important to stress self healing strongly for both a beginner and an experienced Reiki 'healer'.All too often(especially now that people get all attunements in 1 weekend sometimes.ouch)this is neglected and I have seen many who give healing to others without taking care of themselves and personally I wouldn't accept healing from them even if offered it.Obvious signs are similar to frying with meditation, depression, headaches and the usual symptoms of over attuning.Just my thoughts.
L&L
Dave |
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Mike
United Kingdom
77 Posts |
Posted - Mar 11 2007 : 2:46:37 PM
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Disagreement is permissable 
Take care 
Mike |
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Doc
USA
394 Posts |
Posted - Mar 11 2007 : 7:43:33 PM
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Hi guys!
Well, if you take the 'Rei' out of 'Reiki' you have 'Ki', which is represented in Japanese Kanji Character writing by the exact same Chinese Character used for 'Chi'. As such, I believe that the intrinsic energy/ki/chi/prana of Reiki is the same energy as that of Chi-Kung/Qi-Gong Healing, Pranic Healing, EFT, Quantum Touch, Shiatsu, Jin-Shin-Do, Hands of Light, Tsubo, Brahmavidya Healing, Laying on of Hands, and all other energy healing modalities. It is also the same energy that is trained and applied in Tai-Chi Chuan, Aikido and other Internal Martial Arts, Martial Chi-Kung, Pranayama, Kundalini Yoga, and so forth.
Thus, while readily acknowledging that the volume and intensity of energy that a given practitioner might be able to channel through his or her body via each of these arts can vary from one person to another, the energy itself is the same, IMO. 
What differs most is NOT the basic nature or functional capability of the energy, but rather the mental visualizations and directions given to its applied functionality, and one's spiritual relationship to the energy...and the Source of the energy. From the standpoint of my own personal perspective, based on extensive and long-time experience with ALL of the above mentioned modalities, to debate otherwise is a moot point. This is like debating that the essential nature and movement of the wind is different at various locations around the globe, simply because the locations have different names or because it is harnessed for use in different ways! 
Doc |
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Wolfgang
Germany
470 Posts |
Posted - Mar 12 2007 : 09:15:33 AM
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Hi,
I like to chime in here and discuss the meaning of "intent".
A well meant intent may not be sufficient.
A well meant intent could actually produce harm to a person.
Without really knowing what is good for a person we could
easily do harm to a person.
To take the example of Dave (riptiz), if you have 110 Volts
and the person only is wired for 12 volts, then what is going to happen ?
Most likely an overload for the receiving person.
As far as I know, most Reiki-"healers" will ask for the
consent of the person, they ask if the person wants to receive
the healing. But then I have heard, that a patient may ask
for healing of a loved one, e.g. for their partner, for their
parents, and in such a case the consent of the receiving person
is not clearly known.
In an extreme case, there could be a person who has a deadly disease,
and it could be that this person either consciously or subconsciously
wants to die: and now the healer is sending healing energy 
So for me the question remains: when is good intent enough
and when can good intent be harmful ? How can I know ?
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Doc
USA
394 Posts |
Posted - Mar 12 2007 : 09:39:37 AM
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Wolfgang:
In order to effectively give any kind of energy healing, it is necessary for the healer transmedium to have the recipents permission to do so. Without this harmony of mutual intent, to both give and receive the healing energy, it will be a wasted effort for the healer.
The psychic axiom always is "give a healing...get a healing", since both the healer and the healing recipient mutually benefit from the energy that is channeled and received respectively. Only in this way can the healing energy manifest itself as the next highest energetic expression of positive good possible for both at the time of the healing.
Hari OM!
Doc |
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riptiz
United Kingdom
741 Posts |
Posted - Mar 18 2007 : 04:54:32 AM
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Hi,
Well IMO if one simply asks God to give the recipient what they need(and therefore trying to take my ego out of the equation)and having a genuine desire to help another then that is as much as one can do to help another without interfering with the process.Even with consent the client may not think you have helped them much when they are suffering with extreme cleansing which is why it is important to explain exactly what the intial results may be.
quote 'In order to effectively give any kind of energy healing, it is necessary for the healer transmedium to have the recipents permission to do so. Without this harmony of mutual intent, to both give and receive the healing energy, it will be a wasted effort for the healer.'
Well I don't think it is a wasted effort but certainly not as efficient as having someone who is open to receive the most benefit.Nor is it necessary to have permission for healing to work but is considered morally correct.
Mike, yes disagreement is permissible but I prefer to consider it a difference of opinion and no matter how much experience any of us have in anything whatsoever, it still does not make any of us more qualified in each others opinions.Just as I tell my students 'your experiences are valid and the truth for you and I or anyone else are not qualified to discount your truth.With respect.
L&L,
Dave
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Doc
USA
394 Posts |
Posted - Mar 18 2007 : 10:25:49 AM
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[quote]Originally posted by riptiz
"...no matter how much experience any of us have in anything whatsoever, it still does not make any of us more qualified in each others opinions. Just as I tell my students 'your experiences are valid and the truth for you and I or anyone else are not qualified to discount your truth."/quote]
What a hoot! You essentially just considered yourself sufficiently qualified to discount my 'truth', did you not?  You quoted my posted statements verbatim, and then presented the differing opinion of your own 'truth' as if your experience is somehow more valid and correct than mine.
Looks to me like you just contradicted yourself beautifully! Are you striving to 'save face' with your "students and peers", or what? And you don't see your ego in the equation here?
Light to All ~
Doc |
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riptiz
United Kingdom
741 Posts |
Posted - Mar 18 2007 : 10:56:24 AM
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Hi Doc,
No I don't consider myself more qualified to discount your truth or anyone elses.I simply expressed that morally your statement is considered correct among many healers.Many healers consider it morally appropriate to ask permission before giving healing.I don't have the training and experience you have but I have my own experiences and opinions. Even all your chi cannot change that.
L&L
Dave |
Edited by - riptiz on Mar 18 2007 1:39:27 PM |
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Doc
USA
394 Posts |
Posted - Mar 18 2007 : 8:16:11 PM
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Namaste Dave:
How I wish I knew what you thought I thought you thought! In any event, please know that your experiences and opinions are not my concern. They remain solely and totally yours. Employ them wisely.
Please know also that I have no personal ownership of 'chi'...never have had and never will have. It's all on loan from a Higher Power!
http://www.shiftedsands.com/images/...ge_image.jpg
Hari OM!
Doc |
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Reiki or chi?
