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Omsat
Belgium
267 Posts |
 Posted - Dec 24 2016 : 06:07:37 AM
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Moderator note: This topic has been split from here
quote:
Originally posted by Charliedog
Which brings me to the question, as we progress, do we become more sensitive to pranayama?
I would suspect sensitivity will depend on how much we practiced from the beginning. If we overdid in the beginning, which probably happens often with pranayama, given the way it makes us feel, we're likely to become sensitive. Not sure this would be an "advanced" stage, though it might be.
Usually, pranayama practices are extended over time before they stabilize.
My impression is also that bodily constitution could affect sensitivity. Yet, cause and effect might be strongly intertwined, i.e. a larger bodily structure may cope better with more practice and also pranayama practice itself may expand the bodily structure over time.
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Charliedog
1625 Posts |
Posted - Dec 24 2016 : 12:01:53 PM
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Hi Omsat,
Thank you for your answer, I know I overdid in the beginning. I found advanced not an easy word to translate. I don't mean "advanced" as 'reached' something, but more as practicing for many years and kind of 'knowing' how we can respond personally on practice......practice pranayama like bastrika makes me feel ungrounded, on the other hand I wake up in the night very often doing an automatic light variation of bastrika and solar centering.
Investigating the lessons I found in the lessons Yogani saying lots of time 'less is more'
from lesson 411 Later on, when we have experienced an awakening of ecstatic conductivity (kundalini), we will find a self-sustaining momentum becoming active in our nervous system. While we continue to benefit greatly from daily practices, we may find that it will not take as much practice time or intensity to sustain the same degree of ongoing purification and opening as in the past. We have called this the "fly-wheel" effect, where our inner spiritual momentum has become largely self-sustaining. This does not mean we are done with practices, only that we may find ourselves to be more on the "razor's edge" for sustaining good progress with comfort. This is when skill in self-pacing becomes more delicate, with the demonstration of "less being more" becoming very clear to us in daily living. When we slip in overdoing practices, or in our conduct, we find out right away. So moderation becomes the watchword in all things for the advanced yogi/yogini. "Yogani"
What do you mean with bodily constitution? If we are light weighted we are easier overloading? |
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Omsat
Belgium
267 Posts |
Posted - Dec 24 2016 : 2:23:04 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Charliedog
Hi Omsat,
Thank you for your answer, I know I overdid in the beginning. I found advanced not an easy word to translate. I don't mean "advanced" as 'reached' something, but more as practicing for many years and kind of 'knowing' how we can respond personally on practice.
Yes, this makes perfect sense!
quote:
Originally posted by Charliedog
What do you mean with bodily constitution? If we are light weighted we are easier overloading?
Yes, it's one element. Many spiritual practices could have the effect of aggravating pitta or vata doshas as well. Kapalabhati and bhastrika could be on top of the list. These practices are ideal when we are well grounded and established both spiritually and physically.
They have power to release as well as to amplify whichever we are already having more off depending on the consciousness with which we practice these techniques.
One of the most important lessons I learned regarding energy practices is to cultivate a strong awareness (have the masculine component strong) while engaging in them (energy practices). This may be natural if we're established in meditation throughout, but may be lacking when energy practices take the overhand, especially in the initial learning phases.
Back to constitution:
Given the premise that being established in our witness practices AND that being physically grounded is equally important for engaging in energizing pranayams, it makes sense that heavier bodily constitutions could practice these longer with less risk of overload. Kapha types are typically quite grounded on the material sphere. They typically even need more energizing practices for their energies to get moving. |
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Christi
United Kingdom
4514 Posts |
Posted - Dec 24 2016 : 6:24:34 PM
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Hi Charliedog,
quote:
Which brings me to the question, as we progress, do we become more sensitive to pranayama?
This is something that can happen as people progress. It can take less and less practice to achieve the same degree of purification. I have even known advanced practitioners who could only do two or three breaths of Spinal Breathing Pranayama each day.
That degree of sensitivity can even go on for several years. Then, as the nadis widen and become capable of handling more prana, we can do more pranayama and other practices. Not everyone need go through this highly sensitive stage, but it does happen.
Christi |
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sunyata
USA
1513 Posts |
Posted - Dec 24 2016 : 6:47:37 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Christi
Hi Charliedog,
quote:
Which brings me to the question, as we progress, do we become more sensitive to pranayama?
This is something that can happen as people progress. It can take less and less practice to achieve the same degree of purification. I have even known advanced practitioners who could only do two or three breaths of Spinal Breathing Pranayama each day.
That degree of sensitivity can even go on for several years. Then, as the nadis widen and become capable of handling more prana, we can do more pranayama and other practices. Not everyone need go through this highly sensitive stage, but it does happen.
Christi
Good to know, Christi.
Looks like the energetic awakening has no end? Similar to the shift in the awareness after which the learning continues. What's your experience on the stages of energetic awakening?
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Charliedog
1625 Posts |
Posted - Dec 25 2016 : 03:37:15 AM
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quote:
quote:
Originally posted by Charliedog
What do you mean with bodily constitution? If we are light weighted we are easier overloading?
Yes, it's one element. Many spiritual practices could have the effect of aggravating pitta or vata doshas as well. Kapalabhati and bhastrika could be on top of the list. These practices are ideal when we are well grounded and established both spiritually and physically.
They have power to release as well as to amplify whichever we are already having more off depending on the consciousness with which we practice these techniques.
One of the most important lessons I learned regarding energy practices is to cultivate a strong awareness (have the masculine component strong) while engaging in them (energy practices). This may be natural if we're established in meditation throughout, but may be lacking when energy practices take the overhand, especially in the initial learning phases.
Back to constitution:
Given the premise that being established in our witness practices AND that being physically grounded is equally important for engaging in energizing pranayams, it makes sense that heavier bodily constitutions could practice these longer with less risk of overload. Kapha types are typically quite grounded on the material sphere. They typically even need more energizing practices for their energies to get moving.
Hi Omsat,
This makes perfect sense to me, thank you! Your answer confirms my experiences with personal practice. As pitta/vata I did first some years of energy practice without the cultivation of inner silence through a decent sitting meditation practice. This has consequences in my practice later as I understand. To stay in balance my practice at this moment needs more silence and less energy practice. That's the experience in life at this moment, a crave to silence.
quote:
Then, the breathing will have something of a locomotive train and there is more lasting power in it. It can go on longer than a practice that is based mostly on exhale.
The power in both inhale and exhale is what is considered to make apana vayu and prana vayu merge in balance.
I really liked this some years ago, but it's like there is fear inside me to bring apana vayu upwards, what is your idea about apana, maybe my understanding is lacking... |
Edited by - Charliedog on Dec 25 2016 04:11:00 AM |
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Charliedog
1625 Posts |
Posted - Dec 25 2016 : 03:59:30 AM
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quote:
This is something that can happen as people progress. It can take less and less practice to achieve the same degree of purification. I have even known advanced practitioners who could only do two or three breaths of Spinal Breathing Pranayama each day.
That degree of sensitivity can even go on for several years. Then, as the nadis widen and become capable of handling more prana, we can do more pranayama and other practices. Not everyone need go through this highly sensitive stage, but it does happen.
Christi
Hi Christi,
Thank you for your answer, SBP and bandha's are ok in my daily routine, I almost forgot that SBP is pranayama too, as I do SBP for so many years.  |
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Charliedog
1625 Posts |
Posted - Dec 25 2016 : 04:17:55 AM
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| I need someone who can explain very clear apana vayu to me..... |
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Omsat
Belgium
267 Posts |
Posted - Dec 25 2016 : 11:58:04 AM
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Hi Charlie,
Thank you for the interesting question also.
Apana vayu is a downward flow (while prana vayu is an upward movement). Apana vayu activity is located mostly under the navel region. It is related to elimination, ranging from all the physical processes of elimination but also emotional releases.
As for the fear in working with this energy:
Are you applying the bandhas when doing bhastrika?
Usually mulabandha takes care of fearful feelings pretty well. Udiyana bandha is also very powerful in uplifting emotions.
Merry Christmas and happy practice 
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Charliedog
1625 Posts |
Posted - Dec 25 2016 : 2:21:31 PM
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Hi Omsat,
Merry Christmas Thank you for your answer. I will try to explain further. The fear is more a concern of not understanding the following.
Apana is the downward flow also of the waste of the body. All we don't need anymore. When we do bastrika or udiyana bandha it's important to eat vegetarian, have the bowels empty etc. Some years ago I had the feeling there was a barrier between apana and prana in the manipura region. That's not there anymore, so now I am asking myself do we bring impurities in the higher regions?
Maybe this is a strange question, is it more a subtle body happening but for me it's important to understand this correctly. When doing udiyana bandha or bastrika I am concerned that I bring impurities upward, not understanding this is a hindrance in my practice.
Sorry for the simplicity of the language
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Omsat
Belgium
267 Posts |
Posted - Dec 25 2016 : 6:32:02 PM
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Hi Charlie,
Ok, I understand your concern better now.
No need to worry anymore. Prana vayu and apana vayu come together at manipura, the center of transformation.
Also anything that goes upwards from the lower centers passes through manipura, so any subtle"impurities" are transformed and sublimated.
Yes, the energies we are working with are of a more subtle nature. They are part of the pranic energy that is very subtle.
It is not practical and healthy for our organs if we perform strenuous asanas or pranayams on a non-empty stomach. Even for regular exercise it is often advised to wait for a while after eating. Hence the suggestions and precautions that you mentioned.
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Edited by - Omsat on Dec 25 2016 6:48:54 PM |
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Christi
United Kingdom
4514 Posts |
Posted - Dec 25 2016 : 6:53:51 PM
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Hi Sunyata,
quote:
What's your experience on the stages of energetic awakening?
My own experience is the same as the one I described above. At first I had little sensitivity to spiritual practices, then after a while (maybe 5 years?) I became more sensitive. Hightened sensitivity to practices continued for another 15- 20 years and then I became less sensitive to practices over time after that.
Hi Charliedog,
With pranayama and the mudras and bandhas, almost everything happens on the energetic level. So it is prana that rises in the body, not toxins or impurities. Prana also falls, so it is a cyclical process.
It is not important to be a vegetarian to practice pranayama or the mudras or bandhas. They are effective for everyone. It is also not necessary to have the bowels empty. They can be practised at any time. There is some advantage to practising with the bowels empty as the body is lighter energetically and in some cases more ecstatic, but it is not necessary.
There can be a reduction in the downward flowing prana (apana) for a period of time when the kundalini process is strong and this can temporarily reduce the effectiveness of elimination. This is one reason that basti (colonic irrigation) is offered as a cleansing technique for people who are in the middle stages of the path. But if basti is not used, impurities or waste products will not rise up through the body, they simply take longer to be eliminated.
Christi
p.s. Happy Christmas ! |
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sunyata
USA
1513 Posts |
Posted - Dec 25 2016 : 11:00:29 PM
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| Thank you, Christi. Lots of new info. |
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Charliedog
1625 Posts |
Posted - Dec 26 2016 : 03:27:19 AM
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Hi Omsat and Christi,
Thank you both very much for the detailed information, a big help. This info brings light in the darker parts
However I never practice with a full stomach and eat no meat, it became a worry that the bowels are not always empty, I'm working on that part, so thanks also for the basti info Christi.
I felt already more freedom in my morning practice. As I am more grounded these days, I will see if I can pick up the stronger pranayama's and bandha's now and then. There is a desire to practice more intense.
Quote Omsat quote:
They have power to release as well as to amplify whichever we are already having more off depending on the consciousness with which we practice these techniques.
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Edited by - Charliedog on Dec 26 2016 04:56:25 AM |
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Christi
United Kingdom
4514 Posts |
Posted - Dec 26 2016 : 07:14:11 AM
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Hi Charliedog,
Yes, it is good not to practice on a full stomach. Energy is needed for digestion and when that is happening it is not available for purification. The energy of digestion goes downwards, as Omsat mentioned, so it will tend to compete with the rising energy of spiritual purification.
Detailed instructions for basti are in lesson 314 and there is more info in lesson 315.
Christi |
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Parallax
USA
348 Posts |
Posted - Dec 28 2016 : 2:05:22 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Christi
Hi Sunyata,
quote:
What's your experience on the stages of energetic awakening?
My own experience is the same as the one I described above. At first I had little sensitivity to spiritual practices, then after a while (maybe 5 years?) I became more sensitive. Hightened sensitivity to practices continued for another 15- 20 years and then I became less sensitive to practices over time after that.
Hi Christi!
I was curious, during your time of heightened sensitivity did you scale back your practice routine, what did you maintain etc
Any color would be appreciated
Much love |
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Christi
United Kingdom
4514 Posts |
Posted - Dec 28 2016 : 2:51:24 PM
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quote:
I was curious, during your time of heightened sensitivity did you scale back your practice routine, what did you maintain etc
Any color would be appreciated
Hi Parallax,
Once kundalini is awakened and reaches a certain point, it becomes a continuous process of working with the energy. So at times I would cut back on spiritual practices and at other times add more practices, depending on the level of sensitivity at the time. I would be making adjustments day by day, or week by week, depending on what was happening. Practices like siddhasana, mulabandha and sambhavi mudra become very powerful and can be included or left out, depending on what is happening with the energy in the body.
Once the crown starts to open and crown practices are being used, then there are two sets of practices that need to be adjusted, the regular practices and the crown practices. So that adds another dimension to self-pacing. The sensitivity of the crown can be very different from the sensitivity of the rest of the body.
I used the AYP guidelines on self-pacing: Cutting back on practice times if necessary, cutting out the last practice added and switching to more gentle practices such as breathing meditation and nadi shodhana, if the baseline practices became too strong. If I needed to self-pace heavily I would always aim to include an element of pranayama and an element of meditation in my practice, but would switch to alternate nostril breathing and breathing meditation if necessary. I would also self-pace to zero occasionally if I needed to.
Going below the AYP baseline was very rare however, so most of the time I would be using SBP, DM and samyama practice and only self-pacing with timings and with the additional energetic practices.
Just to mention, I needed to start self-pacing before I took up AYP practices and I would often do that by only practising in the mornings and then walking in the afternoons instead of doing my afternoon sitting.
Christi |
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Parallax
USA
348 Posts |
Posted - Dec 30 2016 : 08:27:36 AM
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Christi,
Thank you for sharing your experience, very grateful for your insights |
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Sensitivity to Pranayama and Stages of Awakening
