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runki
3 Posts |
 Posted - Jul 06 2006 : 06:23:16 AM
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Hi,
I am new here. I am little confuse about chakra clearing meditation( which I heard from others)- they found there guide and follow them in there meditation. They get messeges from them too. What kind of meditation is it? Please help me out with this.
Thanks,
Runki |
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Shanti
USA
4854 Posts |
Posted - Jul 06 2006 : 08:32:47 AM
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Welcome to the forum Runki.
I am sorry I cannot help you with your question on chakra meditation.. I don't know much about this. I am sure if anyone knows something they will chime in.
Here in AYP.. we don't put too much attention on the individual chakras. The cleansing and alignment of chakras happen as a result of our practice.. but we do not consciously put our mind on them. Yogani explains it in lesson#47. There is more on chakras in Lesson#73 and lesson#220
Not sure if you have tried Yogani's deep meditation technique lesson#13 Give it a try and see if you enjoy it. Of course if you are happy with your current practice, please do continue with it. |
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runki
3 Posts |
Posted - Jul 06 2006 : 08:56:47 AM
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Hi Shanti,
Thank you for the help. I am practicing Yogani's Deep meditation and enjoying it very much. I would still appreciate it if someone can still help me out.I will look into the lessons.
thanks,
Runki |
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Alvin Chan
Hong Kong
407 Posts |
Posted - Jul 06 2006 : 09:09:04 AM
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| I didn't practise it, but chakra was taught in the yoga center I'm in. I took 1 or 2 classes and so I know what it is. But it's not quite possible for me to elaborate here. For similar forms of meditation, take a look at the book "Dharana Darshan" of the Bihar School of yoga. |
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yogaguy
USA
7 Posts |
Posted - Jul 28 2006 : 8:21:15 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by runki
Hi,
I am new here. I am little confuse about chakra clearing meditation( which I heard from others)- they found there guide and follow them in there meditation. They get messeges from them too. What kind of meditation is it? Please help me out with this.
Thanks,
Runki
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yogaguy
USA
7 Posts |
Posted - Jul 28 2006 : 8:59:24 PM
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| Actualy, from my own personal experience, I found that chakras were a steping stone for me in my yoga practice and would not consider them useless under the hood parts. When I reached a point in my practice where I was capable of a very deep and intense pratahara I was then able to deliberately surrendered my self and my will to have control of my breath. I waited silently ignoring everything even my minds ramblings and need to breath, then it happened the intentional liberated breath. Once I achieved this it was not to long after when I sensed my first chakra in the heart chest region of my body. At this time the pranic shief was also being pierced to the depth of meditation that was needed to sense chakras etc in the body. I began maping my body with my mind searching for the other chakras. Now that I could pranicly feel one I new what the others would feel like if my intense inner awareness happened to activate sensation of another one. It was not long befor I mapped all of them, the third one around the stomach region was the most difficult to sense for me. Now that I could sense the vibration or prana in these areas I began to search out the Ida and the Pingali and was soon able to do a cleansing as it is called in the books that I have read. Finding these and the chakras allowed me enough inner awareness and understanding to eventualy find the sushuma with my minds eye and eventually being able to sense the prana in the lowest chakra is what allowed me to find the entrance for my minds eye to enter into the sushuma along with the flow of prana up to the crown of my head, Kundalini. Upon doing this I was able to see and observe in a different way the operation of my mind, body and soul or spirit. I ended this after two weeks willfully by supressing this elevated awareness back to its original abode in the bottom chakra. I have a job and family and it was quite taxing for me to in a sense be awake all the time night and day! So from my own experieces I dissagree that the parts under the hood are un important, after all isn't that what many people would like to know, what is under the hood ?? The tavel is inward my friends and the chakras make wonderful road signs and maps along the way to what is inside. Sincerely, Yogaguy |
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yogani
USA
5241 Posts |
Posted - Jul 30 2006 : 12:04:26 PM
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Hi Yogaguy:
Chakras are not considered useless in AYP. It is only that they are not considered to be major control levers to promote the enlightenment process. Certainly the car will not go without the engine and transmission under the hood, but to make the car go we use the gas pedal, gear shift, and steering wheel. We don't hold the engine in our arms to make the car go. 
Chakras are profoundly affected by deep meditation, spinal breathing, asanas, mudras, bandhas, kumbhaka, tantra, and other means we use. But we do not use the chakras themselves as the control levers for all this inner development.
In terms of purifying and opening the over all inner neurobiology, the spinal nerve (sushumna) is the king of the hill, with chakras and everything else in the nervous system being connected to the spinal nerve, and subsidiary to it. That is why we do the practices we do in AYP.
To focus on chakras as a primary control lever of the enlightenment process is to risk a tangential path of endless energy manipulations and the experiences (scenery) that come with that. It is beyond human comprehension to cultivate reliable spiritual progress on that level. That is why we regard chakras to be under the hood while we are driving along the road to our destination, using the main controls to do it. And whatever scenery we do encounter along the way, chakra or otherwise, we can enjoy, and then let go again in favor of the procedure of our practice which will carry us further along the highway to ever-greater vistas of inner silence, joy, and outpouring divine love.
All the best!
The guru is in you.
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billeejak
20 Posts |
Posted - Aug 02 2006 : 10:35:43 PM
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Dear Yogani,
In light of the above and in consideration of the respect and admiration I believe you have afforded Lahiri Mahashay in prior posts and writings, could you please comment on the following? As a preface, if not for the open nature of this forum and the maturity I see here, I might not even post this out of hesitation that it might be taken wrong. My only intent, however, is to learn and certainly not to cast any doubt or dispersion. I apologize for my obvious kriya bent but it is, afterall, what I am more familiar with and it is certainly closely related to AYP....
"In regards to the practice of the kriya pranayam or kriya "proper", Lahiri Mahasaya in letter number 79 from his Garland of Letters has stated:
"Many do not practice mantra japa chakra by chakra. When this does not happen, it results in tamasic Kriya (Kriya with negative qualities), and the fruit of this is also "tamasic". Therefore, during pranayam, one must keep attention on the six chakras in the spine and practice japa in each of them." (Lahiri Mahasaya, Source: Yoga Niketan)
In addition, below is a another translation of this letter by Swami Satyeswarananda Giri from the book, Babaji, Lahiri Mahasay, Vol II, p. 139:
Lahiri Mahasay wrote: " Many put attention in each center and do not make japa in each center. In this case, the practice becomes negative. Therefore, during the practice of Pranayam, japa should be made properly at the six centers in the spine.""
In relation to the above, I believe Ron from from KriyaYogaDC writes....
"When kriya pranayam is taught with only inhalation and exhalation in the sushumna nadi or spine and excludes the mantra japa at the chakras, the student is merely doing a physical exercise and not a spiritual exercise. The physical exercise of inhaling and exhaling through the sushumna nadi may prove relaxing, you may feel more physically energized, and may even clear the nadi of blockages but it will not lead to higher states of consciousness because without the use of mantra only the 5 pranas of material substance are being used. When the appropriate mantras of the Lahiri tradition are used, the light of the Soul / Krishna Consciousness is invoked and eventually experienced. The correct method for this practice should be learned from a qualified kriya guru....It is very sad that many people have been taught kriya proper without mantra japa at each chakra. Some have practiced this incorrect method for many years with no spiritualizing results."
Thoughts....
with love and respect,
billeejak
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mufad
44 Posts |
Posted - Aug 03 2006 : 06:40:38 AM
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Hi,
I do believe that practicing spinal breathing or kriya even without japa at each chakra is helpful.
I would not think it is being tamasic or a purely physical excersise.
Many people are not able to feel the prana currents in the spine, let alone locate the chackras, for these people, the chakra bhedan/piercing (thokar of Larhi Mahasaya) is not possible in practice. First comes developing estacic conductivity which I believe is feeling the prana currents in the spine. Then comes chakra anusandhan which is discovery of the chakras, - only then is Nada Sanchalan - chanting in the chakras possible. That is the reason chakra chanting during kryia is not part of the first initiation in Lahiri Mahasaya Line. The third and fourth SRF Yogananda Kriya initiations mention specific beej mantras at each of the chakras while practicing kriya.
Definitely interested to know what yogani has to say about this,
Love,
Mufad.
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yogani
USA
5241 Posts |
Posted - Aug 03 2006 : 10:25:42 AM
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Hi All:
Since my background is not in kriya yoga chakra japa, I can't offer much on specifics in this area. I do agree that without meditation in the picture, pranayama is hard pressed to lead us beyond the limits of physical relaxation, and that there are indeed hazards in doing pranayama alone over the long term without effective meditation added, as discussed in the lessons. As you know, in AYP we take the step beyond pranayama with deep meditation right after spinal breathing pranayama, and do not mix the two practices. AYP is different from kriya yoga in that respect.
I also agree that there is a significant difference in the effects of practices before and after the beginning of ecstatic conductivity. This is the advent of vivid inner seeing, and all that "scenery" we talk about. In kriya yoga, this apparently opens the door for chakra japa, if I understand what has been said above. In AYP we just keep going with the same integration of methods, and the experience does continue to advance.
Are there additional opportunities for practice, a la kriya yoga style chakra japa, once ecstatic conductivity is present? We will leave it to the yoga scientists to answer that one. The open source integrators, you know.
Great discussion!
The guru is in you.
Note: First paragraph edited a few hours after original post.
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bipinjoshi
India
30 Posts |
Posted - Aug 04 2006 : 11:45:54 PM
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Chakras and Kundalini are very huge topics by themselves. I am not a practioner of Kriya Yoga specifically but I am telling my openions based on my practice and study of the subject.
Kundalini pranayama with japa is a very important practice. If I interpret correctly similar technique is called as Tattwa Shudhi or Bhuta Shuddhi in tantrik treditions. Before one awakens Kundalini it is important to awaken each chakras otherwise the Shakti may get blocked at some chakra. Japa of bija mantras helps a lot to concentrate at each chakra location and also to purify them. I have seen people doing pranayama in physical terms but their mind wandering elsewhere. Japa helps you to fix the mind at one point.
In Kundalini yoga the samadhi is attained when shakti unites with shiva in sahasrara chakra. This process is not so simple. Even after awekening chakras one needs to practice a lot to take the shakti up. Shakti has a tendency to return back to lower chakras. It is very difficult to keep shakti united with shiva for long time.
The ancient Yogic text "Shiva Samhita" talks about these experience and various related meditations in detail.
In his book "Kundalini Yoga" Swami Sivananda has mentioned the technique of Kundalini Pranayama (which I guess you call as spinal breathing). He advices to visualize each chakra when breath goes up and down. He says that the more vivid the visualisation of chakra after chakra, the more rapid will be your progress in this Sadhana.
I think no one can say that one technique is better than the other. Experience yourself. Each individual is different. See what works for you and then judge for yourself.
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Edited by - bipinjoshi on Aug 05 2006 01:34:26 AM |
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riptiz
United Kingdom
741 Posts |
Posted - Aug 05 2006 : 3:16:00 PM
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Hi,
Well if one was doing scpecifically Kriya yoga by a cetain tradition then I guess that all the AYP followers would be using japa on individual chakras.One has to be careful as different styles and lineages have different meanings for the same named approach.In the Kundalini Maha Yoga lineage I belong(not K yoga as this is different)we do use the bija akshars for individual chakra development until one reaches a certain level.I know I'm a naughty boy because I don't use the bijas regularly! The butta shuddi we use is simply a very powerful cleansing mantra which is used for japa but not on individual chakras but as normal japa.Normal as in we chant the mantra as fast as possible to generate the energy required for purification.The problem with using the bijas individually is that one should treat each chakra as equals and use the same amount of repetitions on each for the same development.Not much use if you don't finish the whole lot due to lack of time.As most probably realise, the individual practices used in other methods of development(Reiki, etc tai chi )are negated using meditation as far as chakras go as each are developed naturally.What I do feel is a waste is the fact that nobody uses japa in the same way as I talk of by fast repetition as an aid to purification.Perhaps it's not the Kriya yoga way but then who was it said we are practicing Kriya yoga?
L&L
Dave |
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sadhak
India
604 Posts |
Posted - Aug 05 2006 : 10:53:21 PM
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Hi Runki,
In the past I have done the beej mantra jaap on individual chakras. As someone pointed out here, it is a method expanded upon to its fullest in the practice of Tattwa Shuddhi... form, colour, sound, element, organ, loka, diety, sense, and so forth are all added on to enhance the opening up and experience of the chakra.
Is this more effective than what we do now currently at AYP? I can't say that on a scientific level, because there, a number of parameters have to be taken into account. On a cursory experiential level, I can't say I felt any tangible difference. If anything, the spinal breathing method and 'i am' meditation resonates better with me than what I did before. Plus it springs up less deep doubt than what I had earlier.
I realise now that getting a lot 'under the hood' actually is pretty distracting, unless it is your pet hobby, and you'd like to spend a good chunk of your life doing that. Though yes, I do get urges now and then to know more about what is under it, and why something works the way it does or doesn't.
I suppose it is an individual thing.
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Chakra question
