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AYP
12 Posts |
 Posted - Apr 09 2007 : 5:05:58 PM
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Hello all, I'm doing TM practice for 5 years now, and I want very much to start practicing the Samyama at this point. The problem is that I'm not sure at all if I understand how to do it, it's really very confusing me, I read lessons 150 and 151, and I also read several threads in which you discussed this subject, but still I don't understand how to use the sutras. I think that the best thing will be if I'll just focus my points one by one -
1. I don't understand how exactly should I pick up the sutra, I understand that I should take only the meaning of the word (fuzziest feeling) but even when I'm trying to do that I can still hear the sound of the word very clearly in my head like any other thought, even during the 15 seconds it keeps comming up several times as a clear sound, for example when I do the word "Love" I can hear the word "Love" echo inside my thoughts over and over again, what should I do? Should I resist it?
2. What do you mean by "and then letting the sutra go into silence"? Should I just say the sutra once in my head (for example to think "Love" once as a clear word in my thought) and then stop thinking it and just observe the thoughts as they come naturally in my silence?
3. In many of my meditations I don't reach deep inner silence, will it disturb me when I do the Samyama practice? must I reach deep silence before I start the Samyama?
4. I'm just interesting, what do you think will happen if I'll add the sutra "Bliss" to my list? will it help me to feel the bliss?
Please, if possible, try to explain it in you own words, as simplest as possible, links to other pages will be OK but I also want to hear the explanation from you, in simple words as you can.
Thanks very much, and I hope you can help!
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Anthem
1608 Posts |
Posted - Apr 09 2007 : 10:39:06 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by AYP
1. I don't understand how exactly should I pick up the sutra, I understand that I should take only the meaning of the word (fuzziest feeling) but even when I'm trying to do that I can still hear the sound of the word very clearly in my head like any other thought, even during the 15 seconds it keeps comming up several times as a clear sound, for example when I do the word "Love" I can hear the word "Love" echo inside my thoughts over and over again, what should I do? Should I resist it?
Just say the sutra once and let it go, what ever happens in-between happens in-between, just allow it, don't resist.
quote:
2. What do you mean by "and then letting the sutra go into silence"? Should I just say the sutra once in my head (for example to think "Love" once as a clear word in my thought) and then stop thinking it and just observe the thoughts as they come naturally in my silence?
Yes sounds good.
quote:
3. In many of my meditations I don't reach deep inner silence, will it disturb me when I do the Samyama practice? must I reach deep silence before I start the Samyama?
Don't worry about it, Samyama is not an over-night practice, some days we have less silence, some days more. Just do the practice and let it go (forget about it).
quote:
4. I'm just interesting, what do you think will happen if I'll add the sutra "Bliss" to my list? will it help me to feel the bliss?
Good luck and if you are really dedicated, I encourage you to read the lessons and perhaps ordering Yogani's Samyama book is a good idea for you too.
here: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/09...N=0978649621
all the best,
A
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AYP
12 Posts |
Posted - Apr 10 2007 : 5:12:38 PM
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Hey thanks this really helps!
Anyone else? I would like to hear more opinions about this!
Thanks! 
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david_obsidian
USA
2602 Posts |
Posted - Apr 10 2007 : 5:22:56 PM
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AYP, I have to say I find your handle somewhat confusing or misleading -- when I first saw it, I thought it was a forum admin posting.
Would you be interested in changing your handle to something else? There is a precedent for this where someone obliged to change her handle because it was easy to confuse with 'Yogani'.
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AYP
12 Posts |
Posted - Apr 10 2007 : 6:12:14 PM
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Hi David, I really did not had any intention to confuse anyone here with this name, it was just the first name that jumped into my head when I wanted to write here  I'm sure that anyone reading my questions will understand immediately that I'm not the admin of this forum
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david_obsidian
USA
2602 Posts |
Posted - Apr 10 2007 : 10:01:23 PM
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AYP said:
Hi David, I really did not had any intention to confuse anyone here with this name, it was just the first name that jumped into my head when I wanted to write here I'm sure that anyone reading my questions will understand immediately that I'm not the admin of this forum
AYP, I certainly wasn't suggesting that you were confusing anyone deliberately. You are not being by any means blamed for choosing that handle. Rather it is being explained, without any blame, why it is desirable to change it. Yes, I believe you that you indeed just picked the first name that jumped into your head; and it may be true right now that anyone reading your questions right now will understand immediately that you are not the admin of this forum. But there remain sound reasons to ask you to change your handle nonetheless:
Firstly, there is no guarantee that all of your posts will be in the form of questions. If you are a typical poster, some of your posts will be in the form of answers or comments, including replies to other people's posts at times. Someone who is unaware of who you are, particularly someone unfamiliar with the forum, could easily be misled into thinking you are an admin of the forum in such cases.
Secondly, the confusion is undesirable even if it is eventually resolved or even resolved quickly. Your handle attracts attention, and may even draw a reader to a post of yours, who thinks it is an official AYP post. This happened to me, for example. A poster may be drawn to read your post, thinking it is an official AYP post; they may even not have read it otherwise. We value people's time and we value not misleading them in that way even if it is for a short amount of their time. This was the same kind of confusion that bothered people who were confusing another poster for Yogani. That was why some of them asked her to change it. She changed it because she wanted to be helpful; she did not want the handle she had chosen to have those undesirable effects.
Does that make sense?
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Edited by - david_obsidian on Apr 11 2007 12:29:13 PM |
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Bliss Hunter
8 Posts |
Posted - Apr 11 2007 : 2:03:58 PM
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Well, how does the NEW name fits me?
David, your explanation was so good that I just couldn't resist! 
Hope to get more answers for my questions!
Thanks people!
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Richard
United Kingdom
857 Posts |
Posted - Apr 11 2007 : 2:15:14 PM
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Thanks bliss hunter that's considerate of you. You didnt need to re-join though... it could have been changed by Yogani, still never mind its done now
Good choice of name by the way
Richard |
Edited by - Richard on Apr 11 2007 2:29:52 PM |
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Balance
USA
967 Posts |
Posted - Apr 11 2007 : 2:22:15 PM
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Hi Bliss Hunter nice name choice.
Much thanks for being flexible. Helping things flow easier in this world is appreciated I'm sure by all.
Balance |
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Bliss Hunter
8 Posts |
Posted - Apr 11 2007 : 2:31:14 PM
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Thanks very much people!
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emc
2072 Posts |
Posted - Apr 11 2007 : 2:47:05 PM
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Hi Bliss Hunter, a big WELCOME to the forum! What an entrance!  Good luck with your samyama!
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david_obsidian
USA
2602 Posts |
Posted - Apr 11 2007 : 2:49:19 PM
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Good job Bliss Hunter. I knew you just needed to understand, just like Yoginstar, who used to be called Yogini, which people were confusing with Yogani.
Yes, as Richard said, your old handle could have been changed. However, in this case, you have so few posts so far under the old handle that it hardly matters.
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weaver
832 Posts |
Posted - Apr 11 2007 : 2:51:54 PM
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| Welcome again to the forum Bliss Hunter, thank you and I like your new name better! |
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Bliss Hunter
8 Posts |
Posted - Apr 12 2007 : 2:19:25 PM
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To tell you the true? I'm not so sure about this new name. On the one hand it's shows my longing for the Bliss, but on the other hand, the hunter is killing it's prey, and this is the last thing that I would like to do to the bliss... so, what do you say? should I change it to something more positive?
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Richard
United Kingdom
857 Posts |
Posted - Apr 12 2007 : 2:28:44 PM
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Noooo its a terrific name we are all hunting bliss.
Hunting for something can just mean searching its all in the context. We all know you wont want to kill your bliss.  |
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david_obsidian
USA
2602 Posts |
Posted - Apr 12 2007 : 3:25:56 PM
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Yeah, when they say 'the heart is a lonely hunter', they don't mean the heart is looking for something to kill.
Still, the most important person to be comfortable with your handle is you.
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Bliss Hunter
8 Posts |
Posted - Apr 12 2007 : 3:57:49 PM
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OK, Thanks people, I'll stay with this name then!
So... can you please tell me what did the Samyama practice did to you? how did it influenced your life? was the change really dramatic? did you feel it right from the start? from the first or the second time that you tried it?
Thanks!
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Bliss Hunter
8 Posts |
Posted - Apr 13 2007 : 11:04:45 AM
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Was it a tuff question or what? 
Maybe it will be better to open a new thread for it?
Here is the question again:
Can you please tell me what did the Samyama practice did to you? how did it influenced your life? was the change really dramatic? did you feel it right from the start? from the first or the second time that you tried it?
Thanks!
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weaver
832 Posts |
Posted - Apr 13 2007 : 11:41:28 AM
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Hi Bliss Hunter,
Yes, it was probably a tuff question!
I can only answer for myself. I practiced Samyama for a couple of months last summer, then decided to discontinue because of head energy symptoms (not because of the Samyama practice). I plan to start again but right now meditation is all I can do. When I did Samyama it felt peaceful, but I didn't notice any other effects. However, I still think 2 months is much too short time to judge (by the perceived outer effects) if Samyama works or not. We would do well in viewing all yogic processes and transformations as long term.
I think it's best to keep it in this thread, people are reading it!
(Edit: added parenthesis)
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Edited by - weaver on Apr 13 2007 12:23:27 PM |
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Bliss Hunter
8 Posts |
Posted - Apr 13 2007 : 12:06:44 PM
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Thanks for the advices weaver
It's just that I heard that the Samyama should be much more powerful than the normal TM practice, and that the changes are much faster here comparing to the regular practice, I heard that people who are practicing Samyama feels lot of bliss during and after the practice, I just wanted to know how much from it is true.
Actually I heard all that about the TM Sidhi practice but as I understand it is actually the samayama so there should be no different.
Also as I asked in the beginning of this thread I would like to hear from you in your own words an explanation for the right way to do the Samyama becouse It's not so clear to me when I'm trying to do it (And I read Lessons 150 & 151) and I really want to clear things up and to know that I'm doing it right becouse it's very important to me, I don't want to waste time doing it in the wrong way.
Thanks.
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weaver
832 Posts |
Posted - Apr 14 2007 : 01:11:47 AM
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Hi again Bliss Hunter,
I will attempt to give some more answers to your questions above rather than trying to give another version of Lesson 150 or 151.
1. I don't understand how exactly should I pick up the sutra, I understand that I should take only the meaning of the word (fuzziest feeling) but even when I'm trying to do that I can still hear the sound of the word very clearly in my head like any other thought, even during the 15 seconds it keeps comming up several times as a clear sound, for example when I do the word "Love" I can hear the word "Love" echo inside my thoughts over and over again, what should I do? Should I resist it?
The way you describe it happening is fine, at this stage. The process will happen differently at different stages of purification, so in 1 year from now it will probably happen a little differently, and so on. The important thing is to not resist, because resistance will impair all yogic process and progress. The way a process happens when we practice it in a relaxed way is the right way for it to happen at that time.
2. What do you mean by "and then letting the sutra go into silence"? Should I just say the sutra once in my head (for example to think "Love" once as a clear word in my thought) and then stop thinking it and just observe the thoughts as they come naturally in my silence?
Another way of saying "and then letting the sutra go into silence" could be "and let the sutra fade into silence" or "forget about the sutra". When you say "think 'Love' once as a clear word in my thought", it doesn't quite follow the instruction in Lesson 150. It would be better to "think 'Love' once in a very faint way".
3. In many of my meditations I don't reach deep inner silence, will it disturb me when I do the Samyama practice? must I reach deep silence before I start the Samyama?
This is a relative question, what is deep and what is not. For Samyama to work, there needs to be some measure of silence, or calm, after the meditation, when we relax. What happened earlier during the meditation itself is not important. The deeper the silence is after meditation, the easier it will be to do Samyama. If the mind would be full of wildly running thoughts that consume all our attention, then it would hardly be possible to do Samyama.
4. I'm just interesting, what do you think will happen if I'll add the sutra "Bliss" to my list? will it help me to feel the bliss?
I don't know, if I were you I would try it, but give it some time. Sutras are not intended to be changed often, they need plenty of time to do their work.
Please, if possible, try to explain it in you own words, as simplest as possible, links to other pages will be OK but I also want to hear the explanation from you, in simple words as you can.
The best source or information I can imagine is Yogani's new book about Samyama, like Anthem suggested. It expands on everything in the lessons and adds a lot more knowledge about how Samyama relates to spiritual transformation (which is closely tied to bliss consciousness): http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/09...N=0978649621
I suspect that most of your questions about Samyama could be cleared up by studying this book! |
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david_obsidian
USA
2602 Posts |
Posted - Apr 14 2007 : 10:16:19 AM
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Hello BlissHunter,
you are wondering about general experiences with Samyama. To be honest, my best results have been with regular meditation so far. Occasionally I have done samyama and gotten good results. But it hasn't been for me something that multiplies the power of meditation considerably or anything like that. It's more like a pleasant round-off --- when I bother with it.
That doesn't mean that it isn't significant for other people, so you certainly shouldn't take that as any sort of discouragement. The results from specific yoga practices are highly individual -- and that point is worth knowing.
It's just that I heard that the Samyama should be much more powerful than the normal TM practice, and that the changes are much faster here comparing to the regular practice, I heard that people who are practicing Samyama feels lot of bliss during and after the practice, I just wanted to know how much from it is true.
I hate to say it, but there is probably some 'marketing' involved in what you heard. The 'TM-Sidhi program' (which is indeed just samyama as you said) were always a source of very high fees for the TM organization. Samyama can be a good adjunct to meditation. But, to be honest and direct, I think it was over-hyped by the TM organization largely so they could be overpaid for it. There, the spade is called a spade!
There is no need here to over-hype samyama. Since AYP does not charge at all for it, we cannot be overpaid for it. Look at as a valuable member of the Yoga toolkit that is provided here, and no more.
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Bliss Hunter
8 Posts |
Posted - Apr 14 2007 : 8:27:35 PM
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Thanks for the answers, I don't know how to explain it, I know the instructions, and I know what "I should" do, but when I'm sitting with my eyes close, and I try to follow this instructions, I find it very hard to do it, my brain takes me to so many directions, and when I try to take the sutra "in a very faint way" it's just not going, and I just have to say it loud as any other thought in my head.
Again, it's very hard to explain.
About the bliss, I saw some interviews with people who practice sidhi, and they all look SO HAPPY! they have such a big smile on their face, and they say that the bliss that comes from practicing the sidhi is something out of this world. I just wonder if people who practice Samyama from this site have reached to the same achievements.
Is there someone here that have learned the TM Sidhi?
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david_obsidian
USA
2602 Posts |
Posted - Apr 14 2007 : 8:41:31 PM
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About the bliss, I saw some interviews with people who practice sidhi, and they all look SO HAPPY!
Bliss, who organized the interviews and selected the ones they were going to show you?
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weaver
832 Posts |
Posted - Apr 14 2007 : 8:57:44 PM
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when I'm sitting with my eyes close, and I try to follow this instructions, I find it very hard to do it, my brain takes me to so many directions, and when I try to take the sutra "in a very faint way" it's just not going, and I just have to say it loud as any other thought in my head.
Hi Bliss Hunter,
What you say sounds to me like there may not be a tangible amount of inner silence yet. In my experience the inner silence is something that you can put your attention on, and when you do, then there won't be any thought present at the same time. And, when the attention is on the silence, then one can initiate a very faint word, idea or thought - the sutra.
As far as I understand, inner silence is a prerequisite for bliss (or is it not?). In any case, at least from my own practice, I see deep meditation as the primary technique to achieve both of these, in line with David's experience. I have also found what has been closest to bliss via meditation. But, on the other hand I haven't done samyama for as long as meditation, so it's hard to compare. I would also be interested in hearing from others who have done both meditation and samyama, from which they have experienced most bliss.
You said you had done TM meditation for 5 years. Some have said that this should be very close to AYP deep meditation, except for the mantra. But if the mantra is different then maybe the results can be much different. Have you meditated in TM regularly twice a day for the 5 years? Maybe it could be a good idea to focus your practice on AYP deep meditation for a while?
Edit: added last paragraph
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Edited by - weaver on Apr 14 2007 9:39:59 PM |
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yogani
USA
5242 Posts |
Posted - Apr 15 2007 : 10:57:45 AM
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Hi Bliss Hunter:
Check this topic for an interesting discussion on samyama results:
http://www.aypsite.org/forum/topic....hTerms=sidhi
Also, if you like, contact this forum member -- a TM teacher (one of several who have visited here), who now teaches independently and has recommended AYP samyama to his students.
You can find lots more info by doing targeted searches both in the forums and in the lessons. It takes some work to find out what is going on. It takes some serious study, and dedicated daily practice over time. Rome was not built in a day.
Nearly everything we learn for the first time has a "clunky stage" in the beginning. Just keep going with daily practice and things will refine gradually. That is how it is with all spiritual practices. Samyama is no exception.
As has been suggested already, it is best to start at the beginning of the AYP lessons, and go one step at a time. Then you will have the best chance for results.
If we rely on others too much, expecting instant answers, we will likely come up short, and be disappointed. Disappointed about what? Disappointed because others are not doing for us what we ought to be doing ourselves?
If you don't have the patience for it, then go do the TM/Sidhi program -- much more hand-holding there. Ultimately, you will find the same is true there as here. Success in anything takes dedication over the long term.
Don't get me wrong, the TM/Sidhi program is very worthwhile, especially for getting a good foundation in Samyama practice. At the same time, we will only get out what we put into it. The same is true of AYP Samyama, and everything else we do in life.
The main difference between TM/Sidhi and AYP Samyama isn't in the technique itself. It is in the degree of hand-holding from the TM folks on the front end (for a price), versus the degree of flexibility offered in AYP self-directed practice combined with a wide range of additional practices that complement each other, leading to broad results in full scope human spiritual transformation.
All the best!
The guru is in you.
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