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o4l4
6 Posts |
 Posted - Feb 13 2006 : 07:41:45 AM
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Hi,
in lesson 186, it is explained that
"In fact, OM can wreak havoc deep in the nervous system if prerequisite housecleaning has not been done"
What is exactly meant with this? To be honnest, I have been doing OM for some time, and I seem to get a lot more ill when doing mantras. Is this a possible explanation? And can too much pranayama (or the 2 combined) also cause this effect?
Actually, is ask since I tried to corelate the ilness with the mediatiation, but it seems that pranayame is also involved somehow. I just cannot put my finger on it.
Kind regards,
O. |
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weaver
832 Posts |
Posted - Feb 13 2006 : 09:11:01 AM
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Hi o4|4,
It is explained in the AYP lessons that I AM is a dual-polarity mantra with 2 syllables, having both masculine and feminine polarity, while OM only has 1 syllable, and it is important for deep meditation to have a balance of both polarities for optimum purification of the nervous system. So, it could be possible to get adverse effects from only doing OM for deep meditation. Could you specify how you seem to get more ill when doing mantras? And, excessive pranayama can also give negative side effects and kundalini symptoms, it's not recommended to do (much) more than 10 minutes in every session. Hope you can get over the symptoms. |
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o4l4
6 Posts |
Posted - Feb 13 2006 : 11:08:52 AM
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Hi, thanks for the answer.
I do not have particular complaints, just that I get ill a lot more, and seemingly correlated with yoga exercises, but then again, this could be a coincidence. (I do 15min meditation 1.5 times a day, so not even twice as recommended, and less than 5 min pranayama).
But reading a bit here and there on this site I found that apparently, there is a difference between deep meditation and concentration meditation. Could you explain the difference?
Regards,
O.
PS: I actually read a lot of the material some time ago and then started meditating without the theory, as suggested, but now, most of it is gone unfotunatelly, so I apologize if I ask something that has been asked already or that is mentioned in the lectures.
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riptiz
United Kingdom
741 Posts |
Posted - Feb 13 2006 : 11:40:17 AM
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Hi O,
Actually the illness you talk of is IMHO a sign of cleansing as a result of the meditation/ pranayama.You don't state how long you have been meditating but take note that cleansing is apparent more in the earlier days as a sign of impurities in the energy system.As we travel further the signs of cleansing usually appear less 'in your face', depending on the state of your impurites when you start.If one has been practicing other energy arts, (martial arts, Tai Chi , healing etc)then normally the impurities are less and the energy system is stronger and also the history of your life also makes a difference.One who has had recurring or serious illness, trauma etc can expect to need to heal more during the process.As the body/mind has to achieve an extremely high level of purity for the full rise, it is inevitable that you will need to heal and purify.
L&L
Dave
'the mind can see further than the eyes' |
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weaver
832 Posts |
Posted - Feb 13 2006 : 11:42:47 AM
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You are welcome o4|4. If you think the illness could be associated with the AYP practices, you could try to step down meditation time to 10 minutes per session, I had to that when I got kundalini symptoms. Then you could see if it makes a difference. It is recommended to do 2 sessions that are more even in length rather than 1.5 session.
Deep meditation can briefly be described as easily repeating the mantra mentally, not suppressing thoughts, but coming back to it when we realise we are not doing the mantra. We let the mantra modify itself and go to more subtle levels. Much more comprehensive descriptions can be found in other threads in this forum and in AYP Lesson 13. On the other hand "concentration meditation" should probably just be labeled "concentration" because it involves forcefully concentrating on a mantra or something else, and willingly shutting out thoughts or stimuli. |
Edited by - weaver on Feb 13 2006 11:44:30 AM |
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weaver
832 Posts |
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Anthem
1608 Posts |
Posted - Feb 13 2006 : 10:56:03 PM
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Hi o414,
quote:
in lesson 186, it is explained that
"In fact, OM can wreak havoc deep in the nervous system if prerequisite housecleaning has not been done".
What is exactly meant with this?
To add a little to what the others have mentioned, OM is the most powerful vibration and if it is used before a person's nervous system has been sufficiently purified, there is a risk of releasing more latent emotions and blockages than one can handle.
There is not always an immediate correlation between using OM and experiencing turbulence in the form of unstable emotional states, illness or physical discomfort, but it can happen down the road in an all at once kind of way or sometimes it manifests as a slow build up of inner or outer discontent or discomfort over time.
When kundalini becomes active, using OM prematurely can cause the same symptoms as above but also add in excessive energy symptoms (which are not always fun) as well.
Overall, if you plan to follow the AYP practices, it is recommended to use the mantras the way it has been outlined by Yogani in the lessons, if you experience illness or discomfort then practice self-pacing as described in this lesson:
http://www.aypsite.com/216.html
If you do it this way you will have a better handle on what is going on and know what to do when things aren't as smooth as they should be.
Good luck!
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mystiq
India
62 Posts |
Posted - Feb 14 2006 : 10:58:04 AM
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Dear Friends I would like to comment on the mantra OM. About 15 years back, I read a book by Swami Shivananda in which he advocated the use of OM. He also mentioned that Om is a mantra which could be chanted by anybody and that there were no rules to be observed. Also in vedic chants all mantras (most mantras) start with OM. So I used to mentally repeat OM continously for a period of time regardless of where or what i was doing. Other than becoming more involved spiritually, and good things happening in my life, even materially, I have never observed any negative effects, or maybe i didnt notice it.Now that I am using IAM, the use of OM has been considerably reduced.
mystiq |
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o4l4
6 Posts |
Posted - Feb 14 2006 : 12:18:14 PM
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Hi all,
thanks for the many and insightfull posts and references.
I'm trying to somehow reinforce my concentration skills with meditation, mainly for astral projection purposes, as well as getting the benefits of advanced yoga practises.
Reading through all here seems that the system yogani is sharing with us might not be the best choice for me at the moment.
Or did I overlook something.
Regards,
O.
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weaver
832 Posts |
Posted - Feb 14 2006 : 12:50:29 PM
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Hello o4|4,
I share your interest in leaving the body, it was also something I worked on several years ago. My understanding is that AYP will lead to this ability and much more, and concentration will come naturally from the inner silence gained through meditation. With inner silence concentration will be effortless instead of having to be forced. See also this topic http://www.aypsite.org/forum/topic....TOPIC_ID=678 for a description of the relationship between meditation and concentration. |
Edited by - weaver on Feb 14 2006 1:03:19 PM |
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Guy_51
USA
170 Posts |
Posted - Feb 14 2006 : 3:03:52 PM
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Hi O and Weaver:
Leave the body
And go where?
Guy |
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weaver
832 Posts |
Posted - Feb 14 2006 : 5:36:25 PM
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Guy,
That subject would be outside of AYP itself, so maybe we better leave it outside of this forum.  You can find much info by doing a search in Google. |
Edited by - weaver on Feb 14 2006 6:13:47 PM |
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Anthem
1608 Posts |
Posted - Feb 14 2006 : 6:51:27 PM
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Mystiq said:
quote:
I would like to comment on the mantra OM. About 15 years back, I read a book by Swami Shivananda in which he advocated the use of OM. He also mentioned that Om is a mantra which could be chanted by anybody and that there were no rules to be observed. Also in vedic chants all mantras (most mantras) start with OM. So I used to mentally repeat OM continously for a period of time regardless of where or what i was doing.Other than becoming more involved spiritually, and good things happening in my life, even materially, I have never observed any negative effects, or maybe i didnt notice it.Now that I am using IAM, the use of OM has been considerably reduced.
I am not trying to suggest that the use of OM is bad in any way, in fact it is included in the 2nd mantra enhancement in AYP.
If however a person plans to follow the AYP system, which is a powerful and pro-active approach to spiritual transformation, then a person is better off following the entire program the way Yogani has drawn out in the lessons.
The various mudras and other practices outlined are designed to open the purify the nervous system in a specific way. The mantras given are designed to work in tandem with these mudras and practices. Using OM on its own simply changes the dynamics and makes the outcome less predictable and harder to manage. In addition, the mudras and spinal breathing etc. amplify the effects of meditation so using OM in this capacity with the AYP practices can lead to the over-doing effects that Yogani outlines in his lessons.
I am not familiar with Swami Shivananda's work so I am not aware if he advocates any other practices before using OM or if he meant for people to simply meditate with it alone. If it were the latter, it would explain his sentiments that anyone could meditate that way. |
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Etherfish
USA
3615 Posts |
Posted - Feb 14 2006 : 6:59:04 PM
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go where? to the astral plane, or elsewhere on this plane.
i agree with Weaver that this is a good path for you. Although concentrating on the goal of astral projection is a distraction from the path, AYP practices should bring you faster towards that goal than anything else.
The reason is any of those type of goals require concentration, and that requires quieting the logical mind, and AYP is the best way to do that in my opinion.
The other reason it is a good path for you is that kind of concentration you're seeking also requires strengthening your will power. According to Yogananda, will power comes from the third eye, and that's the top of the spinal energy column (shushumna) we work on in AYP. |
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o4l4
6 Posts |
Posted - Feb 15 2006 : 07:47:33 AM
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Hi everybody,
thanks again.
For Weaver: indeed, I read it the first time you suggested the post, it rang a bell and then I forgot again, sorry for that.
Indeed, almost all traditions teach this 3 steps: concentration, meditation, samadhi.
So I guess the subtle difference is that in the ayp case, the concentration lies in the going gently back to the mantra instead of some forced concentration uppon it (is that right?). It is subtle I guess, I will experiment with it.
to robertjames:
leaving the body can be found in many tradition, you can do a google on "dream yoga" for instance, or "astral travel", or "lucid dreaming". They are all based on the same idea basically, only the techniques and the philosophy behind will vary. The bottom line is to become conscious that you are dreaming (a very funny and exaliariting experience I must say) and then take control of it to learn wordly and or spiritual matters (to your own liking). It is part of (some) yoga btw.
Regards,
O. |
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weaver
832 Posts |
Posted - Feb 15 2006 : 08:45:54 AM
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You are welcome o4|4. I am inclined to say that with AYP deep meditation we learn all 3 steps that you mention, concentration, meditation and samadhi, simultaneously. The process of doing AYP meditation produces inner silence which can lead to samadhi by itself. And when inner silence is present concentration can be achieved by just letting the mind "rest" on anything that we choose, without effort.
quote:
in the ayp case, the concentration lies in the going gently back to the mantra instead of some forced concentration uppon it (is that right?)
I think you could say that, because that's where our intention and will in involved. |
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OM mantra
