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RJS
Malaysia
4 Posts |
 Posted - Jul 26 2013 : 04:08:00 AM
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Dear Yogani,
My first time on here. Thanks for the wonderful work you do.
I know you get many requests to help with kundalini symptoms, but this one, I believe, is in another catagory. Let me preface:
I have been trying to help a man in his 60s deal with a worsening kundalini syndrome for a few years. I run a yoga shala in Malaysia. This man first started having symptoms about 10 years ago after an esoteric chi gong experience. I won't go into details, but believe me that we are certain it is kundalini related. About 8-10 months ago the symptoms started getting more severe. More burning, worse pain and pressure. Once a robust man, his body is now frail and weak. Each week he gets weaker and weaker. I understand there is an internal purification happening, but there is also an internal destruction happening as well. He has been to every medical specialist in Asia and London. They can find nothing wrong. He has been to many spiritual masters. Nothing has helped. He is a man of significant notoriety here, and has spared no expense trying to find a "cure." I have studied your forums and read some of your book. I have introduced some of your methods for this problem, such as walking, spinal breathing and dilating the throat, etc. However, his weakened state makes it difficult to make progress. Any time we start spinal breathing his body goes into strong automatic kriyas. More pain. More burning.
I fear I am running out of time. Do you have any other suggestions? I'm sorry, I know this is heavy, but I'd like to help this man if I can.
BTW, I have been practicing your methods and I find them wonderful.
Warm Regards,
RJS |
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AYPforum
351 Posts |
Posted - Jul 26 2013 : 08:36:16 AM
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yogani
USA
5242 Posts |
Posted - Jul 26 2013 : 09:46:22 AM
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Hi RJS, and welcome!
Sorry to hear of your friend's difficulties. There are many possible factors that can be involved -- long term history with practices, personal life, state of bhakti, etc. It seems you are already familiar with at least some of the symptoms and remedies discussed in AYP.
He definitely should not be doing spinal breathing pranayama if it aggravates the situation (has he tried easy alternate nostril breathing?).
Has he tried AYP deep meditation? A few short sessions of DM (5-10 min, not more than twice a day as per Lesson 13) should reveal if there is any relief to be found there. If not, then he might consider a similar experiment with meditation using breath as object, as discussed in Lesson 367. The reason I mention meditation is because, if he is able to get a foothold in some abiding inner silence, this can make a big difference in how he relates to his kundalini experience, and that relationship (cultivated in stillness) can positively influence the course of energy unfoldment, with a lot less angst.
It would also be helpful if you could answer as many of the questions as you can from the forum category intro here. This would give us a better idea on where your friend is coming from, and what factors in his nature (if any) could be contributing to the ongoing kundalini symptoms.
It sounds like he has been very much mentally engaged in the situation. Maybe too much engaged, if you know what I mean.
We'll be happy to offer whatever assistance we can. A clearer picture of the situation via the questionnaire can help.
There are numerous other discussions here in the forums on grounding and stabilizing kundalini energies. Others are encouraged to chime in with suggestions also.
Thank you, and all the best!
The guru is in you.
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parvati9
USA
587 Posts |
Posted - Jul 26 2013 : 11:51:17 AM
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Hi RJS
Welcome to the forum! I'm also in my 60s and can relate to this man's situation because I've been through a similar if not same experience. There was concern I would die from emaciation I'd become so thin. It was definitely kundalini related. So here is some advice based on experience:
Firstly stop all practices and as yogani suggested, if possible cease being mentally engaged with the situation. Both you and he should not be thinking about his being too thin. You should both constantly envision him being strong healthy and FAT. In fact he could say that as an affirmation: "I am strong, healthy and fat." He should also express gratitude for already being strong healthy and fat. Feeling gratitude for health will draw health to him like a magnet. At least temporarily, he should tolerate no negative thinking. When he finds himself doing so, he should immediately switch to thinking about food or drink and about being FAT.
He needs to focus most of his attention on getting both fluids and food into his body. In my opinion it's a root chakra issue with physical survival. It could be triggered from toxins and/or emotional blockages that haven't been released. Whatever the cause, it can be dealt with later, once he gains back a lot more weight. There are obviously many levels - spiritual, mental, emotional and physical. This man needs to forget about everything except the physical level.
If this doesn't work, he may have to be hospitalized and given IV sustenance. However in my case it worked out quite well. I spent most of the time envisioning myself FAT AND HAPPY. I forced myself to drink water and other fluids in substantial quantities at least 20 or 30 times a day. I kept a water bottle with me at all times and forced myself to take sips several times an hour.
I ate the most fattening foods even though I didn't really care for some of them. Sweets, pastries, cakes, cookies, muffins, bread, starchy food like potatoes and tons of butter, cheese, milk, cream, ice cream, and also beans were heavily consumed. Hummus is great which you probably know is garbanzo beans and sesame tahini, good sustenance for the body. Very good quality protein as much as he can - plenty of eggs and fish for me. If the man eats meat so much the better. He should eat as much meat, fish and eggs as he can get into his body.
The bottom line however is: does he really want to survive. At the very least he needs to stay properly hydrated. As for survival - if he chooses life, then he needs to be very clear about it.
Wishing you and your friend health and happiness,
parvati |
Edited by - parvati9 on Jul 26 2013 12:07:35 PM |
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emc
2072 Posts |
Posted - Jul 26 2013 : 12:22:11 PM
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I've been struggling with kundalini overload for years. What finally helped was doing all of these regularly:
- no spiritual practices whatsoever, no reading, no listening to spiritual music etc zero zit
- eat meat
- reduce stress - get routines and a functioning every day life
- long walks in the forest, not heavy exercise it would increase the heat
- physical orgasms to release/waste as much energy as possible (forced to not become tantric energetically flowing)
- water - drinking, bathing, showers, swimming, sitting by water
- working on the psychological/emotional wounds that causes the friction in the body (sort of "let me do the job instead of the kundalini")
and perhaps the best ever, that gave kundalini a real jab:
- abhyanga - ayurvedic oil massage over the whole body every morning before shower with olive oil, I was soooo dry my skin drank bottles of oil
- sit in the bathtub in 1 decimeter cold water with butt, feet and hands under water 5 min before bedtime
- accepting my situation, not panic over it, have faith God is good and will bring balance. Never give up!
I truly hope something will work for him finally.  |
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parvati9
USA
587 Posts |
Posted - Jul 26 2013 : 4:11:44 PM
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Emaciation is severe vata imbalance. What emc said about oil massage is the best advice. Abhyanga is powerful and one of the best ways to begin correcting vata imbalance. He should probably be getting oil massage every day until he's put on enough weight to be out of crisis. If available in your vicinity, get this man to an ayurvedic treatment center as soon as possible.
parvati |
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Sanjeev
India
32 Posts |
Posted - Jul 26 2013 : 8:45:56 PM
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Hello RJS,
As Yogani has already given you precious advise, to which I can add nothing more, but want to tell you my 2 cents worth of experience.
In my humble opinion, there are no yogic or meditation techniques to reduce the kundalini activity, any and all spiritual techniques will only encourage it, which is what you don't want at this time. Only thing that works is to give up spiritual pursuit for some time. To stop completely and focus on nothing but physical life. In crude words, you need to go in a reverse gear and become a materialistic pig. This will stop kundalini in its tracks.
So if your friend has too much desire for spiritual progress (Bhakti), he needs to clam down and become ordinary for few months/years. And take up all kinds of physical activity, but not suddenly. Eating, exercise, sleeping, gossip, sex, TV and any hobbies which are distracting and keep you busy 24 hours. As others have said, he should not even think about his bad health. His condition is not physical, its an overload, he is healthy actually in so far as there is nothing wrong with his body.
I'd agree with the meat advice, but if he never ate meat in his life (like me), his body will reject it, and can make his system worse, so try one thing at a time. Avoiding sugar, onion and other stuff that excites nervous system chemically also helps. So he should eat well but with care.
If he has some negative attitude towards life, like he hates to be in a body, thinks that the body is a burden to be carried and spiritual stuff is an escape for him, then there is a good chance that body will deteriorate. Its as if the body comes to know his intentions and obeys. So a positive attitude and a desire to live is necessary.
All the best and keep us posted. |
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Etherfish
USA
3615 Posts |
Posted - Jul 26 2013 : 9:18:58 PM
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There should be lots of grounding also.
He should do things that bring him in contact with the earth everyday.
He could walk barefoot, swim in the ocean or a river, or just lie where his skin touches the earth.
I have heard of people digging a hole and sticking their feet in it.
Gardening is good for grounding. There are also ways to ground yourself in city life, but these are easier. |
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RJS
Malaysia
4 Posts |
Posted - Jul 27 2013 : 11:48:42 AM
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Thanks to everyone who has taken the time to help out on this matter.
First let me address in more detail this man’s particulars, as Yogani has suggested. As I mentioned, he is in his 60s. This overload was triggered about 10 years ago, after participating in some chi gong practice. I’m not sure of the exact details of that. However, he started having symptoms that very night in the form of spontaneous movements and surging energy. It built up over the next few days. He went back to the sifu and asked him to reverse the condition. The sifu could not, of course. Since then he has been to an endless number of medical specialists, Ayurvedic clinics, chi gong masters, yoga teachers, spiritual teachers, kundalini experts, Tibetan monks, Catholic priests and even exorcists. As you would guess, no one has been able to help. To the contrary, it is likely all of this dabbling in different things has muddled the purification process. He experiences many of the telltale symptoms of kundalini overload, such as automatic kriyas, sensitivity to others’ energy, surging energy everywhere, pressure build up in the cervical neck area and head, extreme emotional sensitivity, etc. From the outset, he has mostly resisted this experience, aiming to get rid of it rather than letting it resolve itself. This resistance may be partially due to his devout, monotheistic up-bringing. Every healer he has seen has told him it is a blessing (in disguise) to have this experience. He says he would not wish this on his worse enemy.
In the last 8-10 months the symptoms have become acute. The energy surges are torrential, the burning sensations are extreme. There is chronic pain and stiffness in the cervical neck area and back, and intense pressure in the head and jaw. The body has become frail due to a loss of appetite, and now there is bloating and discomfort in the abdomen. The energy is very strong. Many times, when we are sitting together, he merely has to visualize me in his mind, and I feel the prickling of energy in my own nerves, and I am aroused into powerful spontaneous kriyas of my own. It’s fascinating, but of no practical use to him as it offers no relief.
Several months ago, after I first came across the AYP website and forum, I did suggest to him that most yogic/spiritual/chi gong-related practices would probably be hindering him at this point. For the last few months we had been trying a program of walking, gentle asanas and spinal breathing, but only twice per week. To answer Yogani's question, I have tried nadi shodhana, but it had the same effect as all other practices: spontaneous, uncontrollable movements, pressure build up and pain. I will follow Yogani's advice and stop the spinal breathing, replacing it with the mantra meditation for now. His symptoms are constant and severe, so it may be difficult for him to engage in any normal, materialistic activity at this point. However, as some of you have reported that this had been beneficial to your cases, I will suggest this as well.
Warm Regards,
RJS |
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jeff
USA
971 Posts |
Posted - Jul 27 2013 : 12:04:44 PM
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Hi RJS,
Thank you for the additional details. Is his monotheistic belief Catholic/Christian?
Regards,
Jeff |
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CarsonZi
Canada
3189 Posts |
Posted - Jul 27 2013 : 12:52:11 PM
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Hi RJS,
Lots of advice here... hopefully something will work for him.
When I sat with this topic for a few minutes and just let any or no words come, what I was prompted to write feels perhaps a bit silly with all the good advice above but I figured I would toss it out there regardless... the suggestion from here is to try engaging in some type of service that this person can feel emotionally connected to. For example, if he is inclined in this way he could try washing the feet of the homeless or something similar. My intuition is that if he can find something that includes direct personal connection in which he is a "servant," he may find some relief. Perhaps a suggestion from way out in left field, but that's what is felt here. Just a thought.
Love,
Carson  |
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yogani
USA
5242 Posts |
Posted - Jul 27 2013 : 2:22:06 PM
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Hi RJS:
Once kundalini is moving, attitude is everything. Since it is an aspect of ourselves and our evolution, fighting it will keep us in a conflicted and unhealthy mode for as long as we are not able to accept that a natural transition is underway. It would be like a seed not wanting to sprout, or a baby not wanting to be born. Not a pleasant situation.
While meditation is very important for cultivating the abiding inner silence (witness/presence) that enables us to go through such a transition with grace, if meditation causes more disruption, don't do it. It is best not to aggravate the situation. Then it will be more a matter of managing the energies by the many means of balancing and grounding that have been discussed. Once a semblance of balance has returned, meditation can be tried again.
Acceptance of the process is really at the heart of it. With gradual acceptance, it can go from:
1. "This is happening to me. Yuck!"
to
2. "I am a partner in this thing that is happening. I will work with it as best I can."
to
3. "I am in active surrender to this divine process, and am living and serving as its flow of love in the world."
Like that...
This applies not only to kundalini, but to the many ups and downs we experience in life. It is all moving energy. Can we flow with it, or are we fighting it?
This is what makes the cultivation of abiding inner silence so valuable. We gradually see everything, including our own thoughts, feelings, and energies as playing on the surface of our eternal transcendent awareness. We become a witness to it all, and we realize that it is all happening as it should. We do not cease acting in the world. We act increasingly in the flow of life, rather than resisting it. It is freedom. All of this upheaval will lead to freedom, if we will just let it.
Every religion has it own terminology for energetic awakening. In the east it is kundalini, and many other terms for grades of it we might not be familiar with. In Christianity it is the holy spirit. And so on. So whatever faith your friend is from, the experience and the terminology to describe it will be there. So it is not a matter of energetic awakening being opposed to any particular religious system. Energetic awakening is a characteristic of the human race in every culture, in every religion, or no religion at all.
It is a matter of understanding and accepting it for what it is within whatever context that works for us. Resisting and fighting it is where the real problems are. If we can find peace with it, whether through the cultivation of abiding inner silence (witness), or through the comfort we can find in our particular faith or philosophy, or through keeping active in worldly activities or service, or all of these, then that will help a lot.
No matter what the approach, attitude is everything... If we do not change our attitude, then the divine process of unfoldment that is occurring within us certainly will. Probably better sooner than later. Everyone makes their own choice on that, as and when they are ready.
This is why we take a measured approach to kundalini in the AYP system, so practitioners can move through it with abiding inner silence, understanding and finesse. While energetic awakening can't necessarily be avoided, it can be approached in a way that is moderated, sometimes to a level of efficiency where there are no overwhelming symptoms of purification at all, even as a lot of spiritual progress is occurring. Of course, it depends on the condition of the nervous system, and the pacing of practices. It is a complex subject. The more knowledge and tools the practitioner has for navigating the path of human spiritual transformation, the better. That's the approach around here.
The guru is in you.
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parvati9
USA
587 Posts |
Posted - Jul 27 2013 : 4:36:34 PM
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Hi RJS
In deepest respect for you and your friend, this tough love comment is submitted in the hope that you will both soon find the required relief... After reading recent posts by yourself, Yogani and others, it has become apparent your friend would rather perish than surrender to the process he despises. He may think a demon has him in its clutches. Nothing could be further from the truth. No healer has been able to help him because he refuses to believe them. And he will also refuse to believe Yogani even though Yogani nailed it. It is his attitude which is killing him, not the k process. CarsonZi's solution will be effective. This man needs to care for others 24/7/365 round the clock. He needs to have ZERO free time for himself. THIS WILL FORCE SHAKTI TO BACK OFF and stop bothering him so that he can catch his breath and hopefully consider a change of attitude. What he needs is to learn how to surrender. By caring for others round the clock, he will learn surrender. Only submission to the k process will bring back his appetite, weight, strength, vitality, love, joy, peace, serenity and all the things for which his heart longs. My sincere apologies if this post offends in any way.
love
parvati |
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maheswari
Lebanon
2520 Posts |
Posted - Jul 28 2013 : 08:13:30 AM
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quote:
Acceptance of the process is really at the heart of it. With gradual acceptance, it can go from:
1. "This is happening to me. Yuck!"
to
2. "I am a partner in this thing that is happening. I will work with it as best I can."
to
3. "I am in active surrender to this divine process, and am living and serving as its flow of love in the world."
Like that...
This applies not only to kundalini, but to the many ups and downs we experience in life. It is all moving energy. Can we flow with it, or are we fighting it?
yoga in a nutshell  |
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RJS
Malaysia
4 Posts |
Posted - Jul 29 2013 : 07:20:23 AM
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Dear All,
Again, many thanks for your thoughts.
Well, it seems that the overwhelming conclusion is that my friend’s deep-seeded negative perception of the kundalini process is the primary reason the process is not resolving itself. Although, calling it an outright negative perception may be too strong. I would describe it as more of a mistrust of the kundalini process.
Believe me, I, and most others he has seen, have told him that this resistance to the process may be exacerbating the ongoing negative symptoms. I feel he knows this too, but the fact remains that he simply does not believe the energy is a good thing – yet. I will revisit this issue with him.
To Parvati9: Of course no offence was taken at your words. They ring true, and I know you are just trying to help. After consulting with you and the others who have been through some bad times and managed to overcome this, I can approach the situation with more conviction going forward.
To Jeff: Yes, he is from a Catholic background. Of course, we all know that people from all faiths and traditions have had positive kundalini / energetic experiences. Is anyone familiar with “Kundalini Energy and Christian Spirituality” by Philip St. Romain? That is a perfect example. In fact my friend has even read this book! But alas, it did not do much to change his outlook.
Thanks again for everyone’s input. I will continue on with your advice.
Warm Regards,
RJS
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Edited by - RJS on Jul 29 2013 07:27:16 AM |
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Vignesh Pillai
Malaysia
2 Posts |
Posted - Jul 31 2016 : 10:02:24 AM
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Dear Yogani,
Firstly thank you for this forum.
I am a Malaysian and this is my first time here. I was just hoping to seek some guidance on my current health predicaments which i believe to be related to a premature kundalini awakening.
Please allow me to elaborate:-
I have been struggling with unexplained forms of physical ailments for almost 8 years now which has rendered me completely weak and experiencing severe discomforts.
My ailments appear to have started after I adopted certain yoga and meditation practices taught by an ashram in Coimbatore, India.
Over the past 6-8 years i have consulted both medical professionals and alternative treatment but without much / any improvement in my condition.
The following is a summary of my referred physical ailments:-
1) Extreme abdominal bloating (like a fully pregnant woman). I have done endoscopes and colonoscopes but medical professionals could not find any faults with my digestion. Often, my entire body appears bloated.
2) Very dried and mildly swollen nasal cavity. Occasionally, there are traces of blood when i clean my nose.
3) Experience severe fatigue (chronic fatigue).
4) Excessive Urination (more than 10 times a day)
5) Hair loss and premature greying
6) Boils forming on the scalp
7) Constipation
8) Occasional Acid Reflux
9) Significant weight gain (almost 15kgs). Currently weighing 123Kgs.
10) Brain fog
11) Poor memory. Unable to remember names, dates etc.
12) Unable to concentrate or focus.
13) Mental Restlessness
14) Loss of physical strength.
15) Lacking stamina
16) Sleeping problems.
17) Periodic experience of static charge when i come in contact with metal surfaces or people. Sometimes i even see a spark!
Over the years, the doctors have performed various types of tests including blood works, organ function tests, cancer markers, sleep tests, but the diagnosis has been inconclusive. The results always indicate that i'm healthy as a horse :-) which is in contrast to my physical experience.
I was just hoping if you could somehow guide me on what i could possibly do to bring back some stability to my system.
My immediate concern is the severe abdominal bloating and chronic fatigue as the level of discomfort prevents me from functioning in my day to day routines, especially with work.
Please do let me know if there is any further information you require.
Thanking you in advance.
Vignesh |
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Jim and His Karma
2111 Posts |
Posted - Jul 31 2016 : 10:55:31 AM
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| I wrote this long posting about grounding. which spawned a long thread, and I added to it over time as I learned more. It's a bit of a grab bag, but you may find something useful there. |
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jean
Germany
107 Posts |
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Vignesh Pillai
Malaysia
2 Posts |
Posted - Aug 02 2016 : 07:51:45 AM
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Thank you guys. Ironically I had come across both those links before too and have tried some of the techniques recommended. #61514;
After further reading of this AYP site though, I came across the topic of spinal breathing which had caught my attention. I've since purchased the E-books that were available (got myself the bundle of 3 E Books) and have found the spinal breathing exercise immensely helpful!
The terrible pressure within my abdomen has somewhat reduced leaving me feeling much much more comfortable. My energy levels and concentration has also improved quite a bit. All this just after about 2 days of practice.
I’m hoping to continue with this spinal breathing exercise for now as I’m hoping that it may be able to bring lasting relief to my condition.
Thank you once again for your responses. I would continue to post updates if there is further progress.
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sunyata
USA
1513 Posts |
Posted - Aug 02 2016 : 09:26:34 AM
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Hi Vignesh,
Spinal breathing helped me too when I went through premature crown opening. Just few rounds of SB.
Happy to know you are feeling better. |
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BlueRaincoat
United Kingdom
1734 Posts |
Posted - Aug 02 2016 : 4:58:38 PM
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Hi Vignesh,welcome to AYP!
It's wonderful you found a practice that makes you feel better.
When you feel ready, it would be good to add meditation to SBP. It's fine to practice SBP on its own for a little while and it can be very good at balancing the energy. In the long run however it's best combined with meditation. Lesson 43 explains why.
Best wishes |
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Poncho
Germany
21 Posts |
Posted - Aug 17 2016 : 04:04:29 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by jean
Vignesh have a look at this: http://biologyofkundalini.com/artic...iaHypothesis
There are a lot of tips on this site how to support the body during the transformation.
Hope it helps 
I'm a newbie to this and definitely no expert - but I had a Kundalini awakening experience last year and have been working through some pretty serious physical issues both before and after. Nothing as intense as what the guy you are working with is suffering but still quite debilitating both before the experience and the big fall off after my intense experience subsided.
I strongly second what Jean has listed above. This site has helped me immensely to get energy and strength back. Following some of the dietary and supplement recommendations has really helped me in my progress.
I found following the process to strengthen my intestinal lining with L-Glutamine supplementation really helped with Brain fog, Chronic Fatigue type symptoms. Then working on some herbs to assist with adrenal function which seems to be overloaded by Kundalini. Adaptogen herbs like Ashwagandha, Licorice Root plus Kelp. Then some others to increase my Nitric Oxide levels (L-arginine, citrulline, maritime pine bark extract) Plus some others to help with vital energy and blood flow and inflammation (Ginseng, Long Jack, Fish oil).
Aside from this in my most intense come down stage I found I simply had to be outdoors in nature. At one stage I resorted to camping in my back yard as I simply couldn't stand to be indoors. If the man you are working with is too weak to walk and do outdoor activities I would advise something like this or simply spending long periods lying on the grass in the forest or on the sand at the beach etc. |
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msri21
India
1 Posts |
Posted - Sep 01 2016 : 05:38:46 AM
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Hi Vignesh,
I had majority of the symptoms listed by you. So, i would like to share my thought about the problem (Mostly based on self-analysis from ayurvedhic point of view).
First thing is I doubt this is symptom of kundalini awakening. What I understand from the list of symptom is it is something related to Vatha imbalance in your body.
For example:
*Abdominal bolting ( could be due to poor vatha, vatha dosha increase pitha as well. this is the cause for your occasional acid reflex.
*Very dried and mildly swollen nasal cavity. Occasionally, there are traces of blood when i clean my nose. Could be due to sinus (it is form allergy which is again related Vatha imbalance. In fact I have exactly same problem)
* Hair loss and premature greying, Boils forming on the scalp are due to dryness (because of vatha dosha). People with dryness in body will experience static (for instance when you get out of car, as your shoes will rub your shoes against mat on car while driving)
*Constipation is again caused by vatha dosha. Might be your 4th point is due to gas bolting. You will feel like frequently urinating.
*Rest (majority) of the problems are all related to Vatha dosha, for instance mental restlessness is nature of vatha (Vatha is keeps moving so people with vatha dosha will feel restlessness)
So this I don’t think you need to worry about kundalini awakening now.
I would say, you can try from this prospective as well.
As a general guidance grounding activity, food, rest will help balance vatha dosha. That’s why you felt relived after SBM.
Abdominal breathing (belly breathing), life style change should also help you a lot.
Hope this helps.
Wish you speedy recovery.
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Severe Kundalini Symptoms
